Ripoff - Marriott Vacation Club Destinations Program - New Point System

=== I don't agree with you, but a salesperson would.

One must distinguish between reservations for owned weeks and point reservations. For weeks, I own the week in the season and can book 13 mos out - I get what I want for great beach locations.

No, you can't book a single week 13 months out using your week. If you convert it to points or you have trust points then you can. To book a week 13 months out you have to have two weeks and you have to book them consecutively or concurrently. One of the quirks is that they don't have be in the same season. I'm not sure if you can book them at separate resorts, I've never tried it.

Some may say the flexibility of the points system compensates for all this. But, if you can't get the points reservation "you want," who cares?

All of the reservations I make and the ones I referred to in my post have been made with points.

There is no which is better points or weeks. Weeks bought before June 2010 are great because you can exchange them for points. Weeks bought after that can only be used as what they are, a week in the season you bought. I use both some weeks I use as weeks, most I convert to points. In order to play the game you have to know the rules and strategies if you want to win. Trust points bought from Marriott seem pretty expensive and are not very appealing to me.

jimf41 wrote:

=== I don't agree with you, but a salesperson would.

One must distinguish between reservations for owned weeks and point reservations. For weeks, I own the week in the season and can book 13 mos out - I get what I want for great beach locations.

No, you can't book a single week 13 months out using your week. If you convert it to points or you have trust points then you can. To book a week 13 months out you have to have two weeks and you have to book them consecutively or concurrently. One of the quirks is that they don't have be in the same season. I'm not sure if you can book them at separate resorts, I've never tried it.

Some may say the flexibility of the points system compensates for all this. But, if you can't get the points reservation "you want," who cares?

All of the reservations I make and the ones I referred to in my post have been made with points.

There is no which is better points or weeks. Weeks bought before June 2010 are great because you can exchange them for points. Weeks bought after that can only be used as what they are, a week in the season you bought. I use both some weeks I use as weeks, most I convert to points. In order to play the game you have to know the rules and strategies if you want to win. Trust points bought from Marriott seem pretty expensive and are not very appealing to me.

We own a substantial portfolio of both weeks and points - most of our points come from deposits of weeks for points. I'm happy with where we are. . It sounds like we are both pretty savvy users of both points and weeks. I don't doubt that you can get some pretty good reservations at your favorite resorts with points. The problem is it is a spotty availability prospect with respect to points reservations over the entirety of MVC resort offerings. However, you and I will probably figure out how to get what we want one way or another. We should be concerned that the program is not getting better in terms of available reservations for points.

One other thought - In terms of unobstructed access to resort reservations, the clearest and most beneficial path is through week ownership at the resort. There is nothing better than owning weeks for hard-to-get weeks at resorts like OceanWatch in Myrtle Beach.

Good luck in your pursuits.

Just reading this thread after 22 years of even year weeks owned on Maui and 1000 points purchased in 2021. We’ve been very happy with staying at our home resort all these years. Due to Hawaii’s Covid lockdowns we used II for the first time and ended up with a week at Lake Tahoe where we (foolishly) agreed to sit for a presentation on the points program. Presented with a “killer deal” special to buy only 1000 points and enrollment fee waived, we took the bait. Only later did we learn about the misrepresentations and omissions. Wouldn’t you think your week would trade for the same amount of points you would need to get the week back? I’d love to know how they rationalize that. We rolled our 2024 weeks into points assuming there was no downside. Since we had two weeks worth of points plus purchase points plus bonus points we decided to upgrade to a 2 bedroom unit in one of the newer towers to accommodate our adult children. We had a heck of a time booking 13 months out. In Feb and March! From this thread I’m guessing if we just keep our weeks for 2026 we’ll have an easier time reserving than we did with points. We are now retired and living in a beautiful area and no longer needing the escape from work and winter weather. Selling our weeks seems financially painful so looking into renting to recoup our maintenance fees. Can someone explain how Hawaii taxes non-residents on rental income? How do they even know about it if the rental is private? (Will use Red Week). We rented one 2022 week back thru Marriott (not realizing what a ripoff that was) and there were no tax ramifications then.

I own both weeks purchased prior to 2010 and points and points are way better because you can stay as little or long as you like not in 7 night increments. Check in Sunday check out Friday its half the points of 7 nights so you can take two of these trips for the same points. Why don't the old legacy owners get this? It's common sense but it seems so uncommon.

jimf41 wrote:

=== I don't agree with you, but a salesperson would.

One must distinguish between reservations for owned weeks and point reservations. For weeks, I own the week in the season and can book 13 mos out - I get what I want for great beach locations.

No, you can't book a single week 13 months out using your week. If you convert it to points or you have trust points then you can. To book a week 13 months out you have to have two weeks and you have to book them consecutively or concurrently. One of the quirks is that they don't have be in the same season. I'm not sure if you can book them at separate resorts, I've never tried it.

Some may say the flexibility of the points system compensates for all this. But, if you can't get the points reservation "you want," who cares?

All of the reservations I make and the ones I referred to in my post have been made with points.

There is no which is better points or weeks. Weeks bought before June 2010 are great because you can exchange them for points. Weeks bought after that can only be used as what they are, a week in the season you bought. I use both some weeks I use as weeks, most I convert to points. In order to play the game you have to know the rules and strategies if you want to win. Trust points bought from Marriott seem pretty expensive and are not very appealing to me.

The inability to use your weeks purchased prior to 2010 due to obstacles put in place by MVC is a potential violation of the consumer protection act

I don't know where the notion is coming from that those of us who own pre 2010 weeks have lost some uses of our weeks. Absolutely not true.

This allegation that the program violates some law is questionable and probably reflects a misunderstanding of the old program versus the new points program.

Week owners are in the optimal position without the extraordinary cost of the points and the much higher maintenance fees. The only real advantage of the pure points program is the ability to book days rather than weeks. The biggest disadvantage of the points program is difficulty in getting the reservation you want with lots of points pointed towards the reservation you want.

Den I hate to disagree with you but feel free to research online with MVC and suit filed. I cannot go into specifics but you are definitely misinformed

The points program is a definite disadvantage to legacy owners

"a definite disadvantage to us" but no specifics????

Interesting, please share a couple of the supposed imposed disadvantages brought on by the new points program to our old legacy week program. I don't think the points program adds much and have even bought several more resale weeks since 2010.

Do you know who is initiating the litigation against MVC and/or who is funding it? I suspect someone would be touting this claim if it had legs or was unresolved.

Flynn vs Marriott Vacation Club The final is not published but this will provide some insight

I am only disclosing public info

I hope you can read between the lines

I did look up the case and did read most of the many pages and findings. I did not see much in the way of findings in favor of the plaintiffs. Reading between the lines is not the answer - look again at the published findings. My read is this case is over and done with nothing for the plaintiffs.

Is there another case that might be more convincing?

I am not an advocate for the points system beyond that it just adds an option to our already robust week ownership. I think the hoax is that the trust doesn't own much great inventory and on its own could not fill the demand for good reservations. Then, it relies unduly on week owners to exchange weeks for points to make up the shortfall in availability and quality. The excuse from owner services is we can't provide the reservations you want because week owners don't deposit their weeks - isn't that great.

So, what do I do? I exchange for points only occasionally to access locations and partial week stays from a limited points inventory. Certainly, we have better options available for our owned weeks such as using them, Interval exchanges, and renting them out. We have bought 10 great resale weeks since 2010 - all great weeks and most of these are very difficult to get into with points.

By the way, we can access plenty of points with what we have.

You are not correct-but, as one of the plaintiffs I cannot go further Thanks

Thanks,

I'll watch to see how this goes. The litigation process is certainly slow.

I am thinking about buying resale MVC point deed, not sure what are the restrictions buy new one from Marriott time share. I am in new this transaction. Anyone can explain pls?

Don't forget, if it is a good buy, MVC has the first right of refusal to grab that themselves. Because MVC need to approve the transfer. It happened to me couple times when you try to buy good value weeks from existing owners, they were bought by MVC. That is one way they can get more inventory into the trust. The second ways is the weeks behind in paying the MF. The HOA has to record a lien against them. There were over 700 weeks in our home resort. But the process will take long time. The other way is the property tax lien against the unpaid property tax, the county tax collector will auction those weeks off.

Not all resorts have MVC's right of first refusal. the USVI doesn't allow it. As far as the lawsuit goes I really don't know much about it. If what I'm reading is an indication it appears that owners who bought after 2010 are wanting btojoibn the point system. If that is the case then they have no case. They knew prior to purchase that they were ineligible to join. I'd be curious what's the plaintiff's argument?

I actually think it is a good thing for Trust point owners when MVC exercises the ROFR. It is likely the weeks they take through the ROFR are better weeks than what are already in the Trust so this acts to beef up the Trust for what we want. The Trust inventory at the outset was not so good as it was all unsold inventory at the 2010 start date for the new points program - likely more bad than good inventory went in.

So, make lots of offers for the good stuff and let MVC scoop it up. It's much better to have this stuff available for points rather than the choices they prefer such as their buying low end junk inventory in bad seasons for us to use. I like to see them grab great under priced weeks in the after market for the Trust.

If Marriott gave me $10,000 each for my 2 Marriott purchased timeshares I would sell them on a silver platter. I see maybe three resorts where your maintenance will be a little less than renting a week through an owner. There are so many Marriott timeshare resorts where I can rent for as little as $100. Per night. Thank god there are a couple of resorts where you can make a profit on rentals. Of course remember that new $600.00 profit for income tax reporting.

I think Maui is truly 'ripping off' owners as we have ALREADY paid for the week so how can it be legally justified to retax the weeks an owner might chose to rent for whatever reason. I presume if you are using renting weeks as a business that might be the case but don't see the RETAXING an already taxed week. Anyone have the explanation from Maui? do other places do this?

Redweek reports your rental to taxing authorities

Yup, that's how we were sold it telling us we could go in for 3 nights ahead in Maui! Nope, NEVER happens! if you can be flexible and don't work or have family that have easy schedules maybe.