Class Action Against Diamond Resorts?

@Irene:

"Susan sent me an unsolicited email encouraging me to contact her to help me get a refund from Diamond. "

As I recall I was engaged in email communications with a mutual acquaintance (about TS reform). Unbeknownst to me, he suggested that you contact me. You then sent me an unsolicited email. Later, I very kindly offered to help you in any way I could with your own TS contract. If you had asked me how I planned to help, you would have been in a better position to judge me. Unfortunately, you responded by accusing me of being a scammer. I did not ask you for money. I did not refer you to an attorney. I did not contact you again after I responded to your accusatory email. In short, I didn't do any of the things "scammers" do.

"The attorney I refer people to"

Are you saying that you regularly refer people to a particular attorney? Doesn't this mean YOU are soliciting for an attorney? If so, you are doing exactly what Don says scammers do. And please correct me if I am wrong, but isn't that "attorney" someone that specializes in brokering SURRENDERS?

"The attorney I refer people to said that he is able to obtain a refund in less than five percent of the cases brought before him."

So he has chosen to pursue a refund for 5% of his clients and he suggests that the other 95% take a surrender. This is ONE attorney telling you how he handles his clients. The information is relevant to THAT attorney and it does not represent how any other attorney would handle a TS claim. I'm sure he would be the first to admit to that fact.

@Don and Irene:

When others advise TS victims I don't usually see anyone suggest that the victim contact an attorney. I am here to offer that advice. People that disagree with my advice are free to explain why they believe some other option would be better for the victim. But I am hoping people can stick to discussing the merits of the various TS victim's options rather than trying to personally discredit the adviser.

We are going to sound pretty foolish if we respond to every new victim by trying to discredit each other. I will continue to defend myself against disparaging comments. However I will take the high road and refrain from responding in kind.

I think you both have some confirmation bias. If I turned out to be the Pope, I think you would still insist I am a scammer only you would add the accusation that I am also here with a religious agenda, lol! I have no illusions that I can get through to either of you. I am responding to your posts for the benefit of unbiased readers.

Don, I will construct a "rant" that covers all of a TS victim's options without your input. I can always adjust it accordingly based on feedback and input from other posters.

@Don:

"You signed a legally binding contract and no lawyer in the world can change that unless they can prove fraud."

Numerous state and federal laws (including fraud) can supply grounds for cancellation of a timeshare contract. These include but are not limited to contract laws, consumer protection laws, and sometimes timeshare laws.

Here are just a few of those grounds:

Implied Contract, Lack of Capacity, Duress, Undue Influence, Illusory Promise, Omissions or Ambiguities, Mistake, Misrepresentation or Fraud, Frustration of Purpose, Impossibility, Impractibility, Unconscionability, False Advertising, Deceptive Pricing, Overcharging,

There are many possible routes to cancellation.

susanb1439 wrote:

Implied Contract Lack of Capacity Duress Undue Influence Illusory Promise Omissions or Ambiguities Mistake Misrepresentation or Fraud Frustration of Purpose Impossibility Impractibility Unconscionability False Advertising Deceptive Pricing Overcharging

There are many possible routes to cancellation.

That all sounds sweet but the one thing that people forget is that what is signed in the contract is what prevails. All these grounds for cancellation that you mention have to be proved. It would then all come down to a matter of He said, She said. That's why the developers make people sign contracts.

Again, all these grounds for cancelling have to be proved.

" the one thing that people forget is that what is signed in the contract is what prevails."

The content of the contract can be challenged. It is not that unusual for a consumer contract to contain unenforceable terms. If you read a DRI PSA you will notice that they repeatedly state that a given term applies UNLESS it is preempted by law.

"All these grounds for cancellation that you mention have to be proved."

If there is something wrong with the contract, it is right there in black and white. A bad contract can be cancelled.

"It would then all come down to a matter of He said, She said."

Claims that rely on eyewitness testimony are a little harder to prove than contract claims. But eyewitness testimony is evidence. And remember, there are usually two purchasers and one salesperson. If you hear two people who are probably over 60, testifying that a salesperson lied to them and the salesperson testifies to the contrary, who are you going to believe? The fact finder (a judge or jury) can choose to believe or disbelieve any witness.

I find it disturbing that so many people believe their eyewitness testimony is not "evidence". The recent TS case in TN was based almost entirely on the verbal promises made during a sale. That couple's experience was very similar to what happens to many TS purchasers. The jury awarded those plaintiffs $600,000.

http://www.knoxnews.com/news/local/court-timeshare-company-must-pay-600k-ep-911937811-353602121.html

Blah blah blah this is just a scam to get your upfront money by an ambulabce chasing attorney. Don't fall for this scam. Stay in the forum and don't contact anyone claiming they can get you money back or get you out of your contract. NEVER pay anyone money upfront that claims they can get you out of your contract especially an ambulance chasing attorney.

Susan, I read the original results to that case and I think much of it hinged on the 2006 CD rom contract hidden in the case and not the he said, she said although that may have contributed to the win. I know also know Westgate is notorious for appealing and appealing because they would rather pay their lawyers than their owners or employees who sue them. They even have a history of eventually settling and then deciding not to pay and telling the winners oh well take me to court if you want your money because we aren't paying.

Even with that said if you bought from Westgate in Tennessee, there is precedent and your chances of winning are probably higher and worth it.

I haven't heard of any such wins against DRI.

Hi Tracey!

"I read the original results to that case and I think much of it hinged on the 2006 CD rom contract hidden in the case"

My apologies. I should have linked to the actual opinion. http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/1532933-westgate.html

First, this case provides a good example of a contract term that turned out to be unenforceable (at least in this particular case). Westgate had a clause that said all disputes would be litigated in Florida. The court found that in spite of that clause, this case should be litigated in Tennessee.

Next, you are correct that the court found the plaintiff's had a valid claim for rescission based on the seller's failure to provide a current, readable POS. That claim entitled the plaintiff's to a refund of their purchase price, which was approximately $39,300. This claim was discovered by the lawyer that the victims consulted. It is not something the average victim, or person giving out advice on an internet forum, would ever be likely to detect.

Finally, the real money in this case was the result of a verbal promise made during the sale. The buyers were told they would enjoy some kind of special "owner's nights" prices at the resort. This program is not mentioned in any of the written documents. The salespeople testified that they were trained to make this offer but that they knew it was not in the written contract. The court found that the promised benefit was not exactly the way it had been described during the sale (sound familiar?) and that Westgate knew the salespeople were making fraudulent statements. Such intentional fraud allows a jury to award special damages that are intended to punish the offender and deter others from engaging in such practices.

The jury awarded $600,000. Westgate did appeal and the award was reduced to a mere $500,000, lol. Still a pretty good outcome for the plaintiffs.

"if you bought from Westgate in Tennessee, there is precedent and your chances of winning are probably higher"

There is nothing special about a timeshare case. The law is what it is. The claims in this case would be valid anywhere in the country, against any timeshare developer.

"and worth it."

Worth what? The work of finding a good attorney that will take your case on a contingency basis? It is true that the victim will have to invest some time and kiss a lot of frogs before finding her prince of an attorney, lol. I do hope I can make that process easier for people by telling them how to cast a wide net with very little work on their part.

It is not unusual to contact 20-50 attorneys before you find the one that is right for you and your situation. The internet makes that chore fairly easy though.

"I haven't heard of any such wins against DRI."

Do you think that is because DRI never breaks the law, or that DRI is somehow above the law? More likely it is because of the perpetuation of the myth that it is a bad idea to consult an attorney in these cases. The people that are smart enough to ignore that myth and find an attorney, get paid off in a settlement and then there is a non-disclosure clause.

Why didn't Westgate pay off the plaintiffs and avoid all that bad publicity from the trial? My guess is that the plaintiffs' attorney was very confident about what that case was going to be worth if it got in front of a jury. Westgate must have taken a different view. Settlement is a game of chicken. Each side is gambling on the potential outcome of going to court. The plaintiffs' attorney may have been holding out for a lot more money than Westgate thought a jury would award. Westgate gambled and lost.

I enjoyed the discussion of this case. I will eventually publish the opinion on my own site. I will go through it blow by blow to show people how there ARE laws to address the deceptive practices of these TS developers. This case really is a great example of how no contract is "iron clad" and businesses can only get away with conning you if you let them.

Susan is not your real name and you refuse to even disclose your gender. My friend forwarded your email to me months ago. Suddenly out of the blue a few weeks ago I received an unsolicited email from you encouraging me to contact you to be awarded money back on my timeshare. Professionals don't usually solicit business telling people they are being screwed. What is so hard about disclosing your identity and website? Given so many scams how is anyone to know you are not soliciting business if you won't disclose who you are. You were removed from TUG. Email me and give me your website. I would love to meet you if you are honest.

"Susan is not your real name and you refuse to even disclose your gender."

I don't recall you asking my gender but I am female. Btw, the only reason you know that Susan is an alias, is that I disclose that fact to people as soon as I email them privately. I don't have to do that. I could easily have you researching everyone named Susan Harbison and trying to guess which one of them I am. Leaving you in the dark would save me some grief. But I pride myself on having integrity and lying by omission is the same as other types of lying. I don't lie. I have explained all of this to you repeatedly. My behavior is totally inconsistent with someone that is a scammer, but you choose to ignore those facts because you want to be right.

"Suddenly out of the blue a few weeks ago I received an unsolicited email from you encouraging me to contact you to be awarded money back on my timeshare."

As I explained in my email, my offer was in response to the fact that I had recently seen you complaining on here about being stuck with DRI.

" Professionals don't usually solicit business telling people they are being screwed."

As I've repeatedly told you, I am not soliciting any business. Why can't you accept that?

" What is so hard about disclosing your identity and website?"

My website is under development. As for my anonymity, it's a personal choice that I expect others to respect, as I respect their choices.

" Given so many scams how is anyone to know you are not soliciting business if you won't disclose who you are."

No one but you has had a problem with it. Frankly, I am offering to help people for free and if they don't want my help on my terms, I'm fine with that.

" You were removed from TUG."

I sure was. I'm kind of proud of that. What is your point?

"Email me and give me your website. I would love to meet you if you are honest."

What you mean is you'd love to meet me if I am willing to give in to your demands. In twenty years on the internet, I've never had anyone respond the way you have to my choice to remain anonymous. We are clearly incompatible and that is ok. I wish you well.

wanting more information on how to get of my "mortgage", timeshare held with Diamond Resorts without paying an arm and a leg. I felt they were snake charmers and I unfortunately fell for it and find myself hooked and unable to shake them even when I have caught them red handed in deceptive selling points. They always seems to have an explanation for their position and why it is like it is, but will not listen to anything you have to say about the trauma you experience being raped by their representatives for 3/4 of a day. On a presentation that was suppose to be 90 minutes.

brendag239 wrote:

wanting more information on how to get of my "mortgage", timeshare held with Diamond Resorts without paying an arm and a leg.

For one thing, it's likely that the mortgage is being held by a third party finance company, not with DRI but I could be wrong so you should check your papers.

The only way to really get out of such a mortgage is to stop paying. Obviously you would face consequences such as harassing collection calls and letters and likely a ding on your credit score or rating. You might even have a talk with the mortgage lender and see if you can negotiate some sort of a buyout solution where you will pay only a portion of the remaining mortgage.

But do not seek out various companies or law firms (they will cost you an arm and a leg) who claim they can magically make your mortgage disappear.

NEVER pay anyone money upfront that claims they can get you out of your contract. There are scammers trolling the forums for victims. Some of them try to steer you to a website or email. Be very careful they can hack your computer. NEVER open an attachment or go to a link. Just going to a website or connecting through email makes you vulnerable to having your computer hacked.

Some of the scammers lead you along claiming there are no fees but once they set the hook they claim you need to send them money . They are very good at what they do. They will pose as satisfied customers and even a consumer advocate. Don't believe anything you can't verify. What do you know about these people other than what they tell you ? Stay safe and stay in the open forum where others can expose their scams.

NEVER give your credit card information to anyone . Don't risk becoming a victim of identity theft. NEVER give out personal information to anyone .

Ask question and always be suspicious of anyone claiming they can help you. The forums are the safest place to discuss any subject and others can warn you if a scammer tries to lure you away from here.

@Brenda:

You have several options but they depend on the specifics of your situation. What is your state of residence, what state were you in when you made the purchase, are you over age 60, how long have you owned the contract?

Susan, I receive daily emails from people wanting me to rent my points, sell my timeshare, relinquish my timeshare, list my timeshare or take a vacation for free - so when you emailed and said you could get me out of my contract with a refund, my radar went up. One of the timeshare lawyers I interact with said they receive a monetary refund in less than 5% of cases. If you had reached out to me through RedWeek instead of through my email I would not have been upset. I apologize if you are who you are. I have come across several "lawyer" brokers soliciting business for timeshare law firms. I hope someday you do have a website accessible for all. Combating so much deception and aggression from the timeshare companies we have invested so much in, is bad enough, but advocates should not smear each other if it can be avoided. To err is human.

Hi guys, Brenda from Conn. here. I honestly don't know how this works or how to proceed here. I desperately need and want out of this Diamond Resorts time share. Please, please give me the forum, names of helpful honest people that can help me, Thanks so very much, DESPERATE IN CONN.

In response to the question, yes I'm over 60, retired . Bought the time share last Jan.2016 in Vegas. Then was sold a bill of goods in April 2016 in Williamsburg ,Va. I am from Conn. Thanks for listening

jeff_reports wrote:

Please email me at jeff@redweek.com; I am writing a new story on Diamond issues for owners.

Jeff I'm an owner of a Diamond resort in Florida, and a previous board member, can I give you a call?

brendag239 wrote:

Hi guys, Brenda from Conn. here. I honestly don't know how this works or how to proceed here. I desperately need and want out of this Diamond Resorts time share. Please, please give me the forum, names of helpful honest people that can help me, Thanks so very much, DESPERATE IN CONN.

See the pinned thread under Timeshare Companies about Diamond's program where, for a small charge, you can surrender your timeshare back. There is no need to hire a lawyer for this.

problem is if Brenda bought 2 different times this year, it is likely the points aren't paid off and the deed back program is only for paid of contracts in good standing.

brendag239 wrote:

In response to the question, yes I'm over 60, retired . Bought the time share last Jan.2016 in Vegas. Then was sold a bill of goods in April 2016 in Williamsburg ,Va.

I am from Conn. Thanks for listening

I AM NOT A LAWYER AND NOTHING I SAY CAN BE CONSTRUED AS LEGAL ADVICE.

I am a consumer activist and have been investigating DRI for 18 months. You will see conflicting advice on these forums. I suggest you check the credibility of any advice by asking the adviser for the factual basis of his advice.

There is a myth in all of the timeshare forums (it was likely planted and perpetuated by the developers themselves) that a timeshare buyer has no practical legal recourse. People do get refunds but when they do they have to sign a non-disclosure clause. As a result, there are no public reports of their success and the myth lives on.

Convinced by strangers on the internet that there is no other way out, tens of thousands of people have allegedly surrendered their memberships. A surrender is the worst possible outcome for the buyer and should only be considered as a last resort.

I believe you will be able to cancel with a refund. Here is just part of your CT Timeshare Act. It may help you get a better idea of your rights.

http://law.justia.com/codes/connecticut/2013/title-42/chapter-734b/section-42-103tt

It is my opinion that timeshare victims should exercise their rights and get their money back. I realize most people don't know how to assert their rights and I am happy to help where I can.

I think the first step is to write DRI a demand letter, explaining why you are entitled to cancel and informing them that you will retain an attorney if necessary. A demand letter that is not on a law firm's letterhead has little chance of being taken seriously, but it's worth a try. If your letter succeeds, you don't have to share any of your refund with an attorney. WINNING! Google "how to write a demand letter".

If your letter doesn't work, the next step is to find an attorney that is well versed in timeshare and/or consumer law to represent you on a contingency basis. Finding the right attorney can be challenging, but if you know what to look for you will find one.

If you google "timeshare attorney" you are going to see numerous firms that want to obtain a surrender for you. Sometimes you have to read a website very carefully to see that they are pushing surrenders. I would avoid any firm that seems to push surrenders. I can tell you more about how to find the right attorney if it becomes necessary.

I suggest you take it one step at a time and prepare a demand letter. The sooner you contact DRI and let them know you intend to cancel, the better it will be for you.

Feel free to ask more questions.

Finally, it is extremely important to report improper business practices to the appropriate government agencies. In your case it would be the attorneys general of Nevada and Virginia. You will be forced to document the facts of your case for your demand letter anyway, it would be simple to send copies of the letter to the appropriate authorities.

The higher the number of complaints that are filed, the harder it is for the TS industry to persuade the government to look the other way. The appalling practices that have gone on for decades, will continue unabated until the volume of complaints reaches a level that cannot be ignored.