TimeshareMLS.org resale scam

Dear Customers,

It has recently come to our attention that a former business partner is reporting libel about our company and our sales methods. We would like to formally advice you that we believe Gary Manning from Gray, Tennessee, intention is to damage our companies reputation. His stories are entirely one sided and slanted. If you have found this post then you have also found Gary's' other posts, and you might have noticed that he is 95% of any complaints. Gary was not a customer of ours nor does he realize the dedication we have to our customers. Gary is upset of his misfortune and blames our company. We are working with a very experienced law firm that specializes in internet defamation, libel, and extortion. We have been advised we have a strong case. We understand that in order to attract timeshare buyers and renters to our inventory we must protect our reputation. We have over 1,100 networked brokers that have access to our inventory and that number grows every week. We have posted a discredit of Gary to some of the reports, and, as you will see, he is no consumer advocate. Wherever Gary has posted on the internet we have followed and have noticed he is one of very few posting a negative experience in regards to our company. To date we have not lost the trust of one advertising and marketing agreement with our clients, and we plan to keep it that way. As you are aware, we protect our customers with a recorded verification that describes exactly what our program entails. If you have any questions in regards to the listed reports please contact our Customer Service department:

TimeshareMLS.org Customer Service Department 321-251-4607 Option 1 M-T 10-6 EST F 9-5 EST

Thank you, The Timeshare MLS Staff

I admit, as the above post by The Timeshare MLS Staff indicates I am not, nor have I claimed to be a consumer advocate. I am however someone who believes the advance fee timeshare resale industry has no merit what so ever. From my experience and the additional information I have learned since then I know there is no question of this. As a result I am doing my best to inform and educate timeshare owners. This is getting much easier since many timeshare owners have already been burned 1, 2,3 times or more by the many companies selling these resale packages. They may not be posting their experiences on forums but that doesn't mean it hasn't happend.

As far as a lack of online complaints is concerned, few people who have actually been burned by any type of company will post their experiences online. There are many reasons for this, some are embarrassed, some haven't thought about it, some fell there's no use to, some go straight to the state or federal agencies, some chalk it up to a bad choice and let it go or any number of other reasons. There are still yet others who have been signed up with the company for 5,6, 7 months with no inquiries about their unit and are still holding out hope that by some miracle they will get lucky, very very lucky. These people still realize they've made a bad choice going through an advance fee resale company.

The Timeshare MLS Staff states " we protect our customers with a recorded verification that describes exactly what our program entails". A lot of people already realize and for those that don't "Verification" is for the company's protection and not the clients. When Ms. Smith calls back and says Agent Tony said my unit would definitely sell in 90 days I want my money back. Well, the verification dept. is able to play back the tape for Ms. Smith and yes, it states that if the timeshare isn't sold in 90 days we will continue to advertise your timeshare at the company's expense. That is you agreeing to this on the tape isn't it? Yes Ms. Smith replies. Ok, you will not receive a refund, however, you can take comfort in knowing that the $1000 you paid for our service and hasn't brought you any inqueries to date still enables your unit to be advertised on our site, good luck. Now the conversation may not go exactly like that but you get the point--verification equals protection for the company. Plus, verification doesn't record the sales pitch the resale agent has gone through with the customer and all the promises or misleading information they have used to get the client to verification.

I urge anyone reading this not to take my word for all I written about this company and this industry. I do stand 100% behind what I have written though. I just suggest call the Florida Attorney General's Office and ask them about this company or principals of it.

If anyone wants to contact me personally just let me know and I'll be more than happy to oblige you.

I've gotta go now, I'd say it's a safe bet the fine folks at Timeshare MLS have placed their above post on the other sites they eluded to so I've got anwer them on those as well.

This part of Timeshare MLS's post needed to be addressed by itself. They state " We are working with a very experienced law firm that specializes in internet defamation, libel, and extortion", which I'm not too concerned with because I doubt they can actually prove defamation and libel if it were to come to a court case.

As before the have thrown out "extortion" which I feel is their attempt to have people question my real motives. I've said this before, when I closed my office I did ask to be reimbursed for my expenses since I went into business with them in good faith.

I didn't mention an amount and I didn't threaten them with a lawsuit when the General Manager, Jon Warren of Orlando said no. That was the end of the discussion about reimbursement and money was never mentioned again.

Did I think my expenses were going to be reimbursed, absolutely not, nut it didn't hurt to ask.

So extortion, that's most definitely not something they can even remotely come close to aledging.

Why do I think the real reason behind their post is? I do feel they are losing some sales. In order to try and turn the tide they are throwing out words like libel and extortion to try and get potential customers to think there is some crazy guy out there to bring their business down and they are just poor victims.

Another reason, maybe they are trying to intimidate me with this post indirectly as well, I'm not sure. I think it's more a matter of trying to give themselves credibility for anyone who may read any posts I have made.

If they would like to bring a suit against me I'm not real real concerned about that either.

One more thought....

I just find it strange that a true life legitimate company of any type would feel the need to go out and register the name in every domain available of someone who had made a complaint about their company.

CHL Marketing or Jon Warren who is the General Manager of CHL Marketing now owns my name in every variation possible, garymanning.com, garymanning.info, gary-manning.com, gary-manning.us and so on.

Does the Wal Mart Corp. register the names of customers every time they receive complaint? You know they get a complaint or two. When Bill O'reilly says the oil company's are basically ripping off the american public at the pumps did Exxon, Shell or any of the other companies try to register whatever version of Bill's name that still might be available?

It's just very odd that Jon Warren representing CHL Marketing would do this. Does anyone have thoughts one way this very "reputable" company as they infer would do this.

Jon, any comments from you?

legald wrote:

Dear Customers, It has recently come to our attention that a former business partner is reporting libel about our company and our sales methods. We would like to formally advice you that we believe Gary Manning from Gray, Tennessee, intention is to damage our companies reputation. His stories are entirely one sided and slanted. If you have found this post then you have also found Gary's' other posts, and you might have noticed that he is 95% of any complaints. Gary was not a customer of ours nor does he realize the dedication we have to our customers. Gary is upset of his misfortune and blames our company. We are working with a very experienced law firm that specializes in internet defamation, libel, and extortion. We have been advised we have a strong case. We understand that in order to attract timeshare buyers and renters to our inventory we must protect our reputation. We have over 1,100 networked brokers that have access to our inventory and that number grows every week. We have posted a discredit of Gary to some of the reports, and, as you will see, he is no consumer advocate. Wherever Gary has posted on the internet we have followed and have noticed he is one of very few posting a negative experience in regards to our company. To date we have not lost the trust of one advertising and marketing agreement with our clients, and we plan to keep it that way. As you are aware, we protect our customers with a recorded verification that describes exactly what our program entails. If you have any questions in regards to the listed reports please contact our Customer Service department:

TimeshareMLS.org Customer Service Department 321-251-4607 Option 1 M-T 10-6 EST F 9-5 EST

Thank you, The Timeshare MLS Staff

If your company charges an upfront fee in the hundreds of dollars then you are guility as charged. There have been many people that have reported being burned by upfront fee companies, and some people have gone on to get burned more than once by other upfront fee companies that have told them outfight lies. Upfront fee companies take the client's money and the client never hears from them again. It's classic and it's a scam.

Until you change your practice of charging upfront fees no matter what you might call it (listing fee, marketing fee, selling fee, advertising fee etc.) you and companies like yours will continue to get complaints from consumers that's been had.

It appears CHL Marketing, Inc. the owner of timesharemls.org and timesharefsbo.com will be starting a new website.

This is more than likely due to the fact that after a time their scam will catch up with them since they provide no value to the timeshare owners who purchase their resale package.

Also, in the case of timesharemls.org it is a prudent move since any search for their name on the internet will comeback with countless negative information in regards to their company. This makes it tough for them to over come credibility concerns of their potential victims who do research them online.

I'm not completely sure of the new name but I do know it will include some variation of "gmac & resale(s)". It is quite possible the new name will be timeshareresalesgmac.com. This name has been registered by the wife of the owner of CHL Marketing, Inc. since 2003.

The dangerous element of this new name will be their attempt to establish credibility by having the GMAC connection.

re: Gary Manning-while reading your postings on this site, I found it ironic that anyone would want to register your name, or even that it has any value to anyone other than Gary Manning. How does anyone like myself really know if you did not register your name yourself under someone else's identity, as you know is really easy to do? Its not like the name Gary Manning is a newsworthy name or you are a well known personality. If this was really done to you, then why have you not trademarked your name (like other individuals and celebrities do), and take your domain name back? Instead you state that you don't care that someone registering your name, yet you complain about it and do nothing about it. What I really want to know is what is the problem you have with CHL Marketing and its owners? You come across as being very bitter and vindictive person who had a bad personal experience. Were you a client or were you a business partner??? Which is it? I'm asking because I've done business with timeshares MLS and have rented timeshares for getaways, and my sister has purchased 2 timeshares through their company for less than she would have bought them resort direct. So please clarify, because your problem seems to be personal attacks against individuals of the company, (like slander) and not against the company's business practices. But if the company is doing bad business with clients, I'd like to know.

Fair question about the name being registered Edmonal.

As far as my name being registered I am not famous or newsworthy and I'm certainly not going through the expense to trademark my name just for the heck of it.

It boggled my mind why Jon Warren of CHL Marketing would register it as well. There wouldn't be any reason other than at some point his wanting to be vendictive with some anti gary site. That's just a speculation on my part. I did have garymanning.com registered about 5 years ago but let the registration expire since I had no intentions of doing anything with it.

To answer your question as to why Jon Warren did it you will need to call him at his office 1 (877) 349-3440 and ask him yourself.

At first Jon had it registered in his name and as was pointed out to me by someone that use to work with his company he used his home address. After checking again Jon has changed this registration to a proxy registration company.

As far as you asking me what my problem is with this company all you have to do is read this entire thread and that will pretty much cover all the questions you asked.

Thanks for the questions. Happy to answer any.

This is a disclaimer from Timeshare Xchange MLS www.tsxmls.com. We are a true Multiple Listing Service for Timeshare. None of our Brokers charge an upfront fee. We have many complaints against TimeshareMLS.org that come into our office. Reading the above the person who had some luck with the Company was lucky or ?

Although Legald of timesharemls.org never addresses the validity of his company's advance fee advertising service for timeshare owners in the above posts lets give him the benefit of a doubt and say that he believes, at least just a tiny bit, that they aren't completely an old fashion scam. If you do have a least that little bit of faith that your company can stand up to some tough questioning by an investigative reporter then let me know. I'm sure I can get you on the trouble shooter judd show to tell your side of the story. Do you accept?

I have been informed that CHL Marketing, Inc. (timesharemls.org, timesharefsbo.com, timeshareresalesusa.com) has contacted the Florida Attorney General's Office in Orlando and requested all documents the AG's office has on them. Apparently under the Freedom of Information Act a company can do this and receive it in certain circumstances.

Although any company can do this I doubt most legitimate companies do this as a normal course of doing business. I submit only a company that is concerned about what information the AG may have on them will do this.

Now CHL Marketing may respond that (in their words) I am conducting a one man "libel and slander" campaign against them that they merely want to see what false and "slanderous" material I may have sent to the Florida AG. They may contend they have nothing to worry about but wanted to see what the AG had anyway.

Maybe they might even say they are researching for their "pending" legal action against me.

If they weren't an advance fee timeshare resale company maybe one could possibly believe this.

However, to pre-address their response to this or another "discredit" of me or "pending" statement or whatever they may offer up I just want to say, I would be crazy to send anything to the Florida AG or any other AG's office if it weren't completely backed up with proof--if in fact I did present the AG with anything.

Legald and the Timesharemls.org staff is aware of what I may or may not presented to the AG so there's no fresh news here in regards to that.

Maybe it's just me being cynical but if they weren't concerned about what possibly could be out there on them then they wouldn't be all that concerned with the AG.

When you operate "in the gray area" of doing business as one highly ranking member of the timesharemls.org staff once told me then you always gotta have that gut feeling something's out there just waiting to pop up.

This is the same guy that said and I paraphrase " it's not good for a sales rep to have too much integrity when selling our services..........the reps need to ask themselves, would they rather have integrity or would they rather have money". That speaks volumes for the company and the industry.

Does anyone know what the outcome or judgement was in the follwing: Brown v. CHL Marketing, Inc. et al Plaintiff: Erin Brown Defendant: CHL Marketing, Inc. and Howard Levene Case Number: 6:2007cv00854 Filed: May 21, 2007 Court: Florida Middle District Court Office: Orlando Office [Court Info ] County: Orange Presiding Judge: Judge Gregory A. Presnell Referring Judge: Magistrate Judge David A. Baker Nature of Suit: Labor - Fair Labor Standards Act Cause: 29:201 Fair Labor Standards Act Jurisdiction: Federal Question Jury Demanded By: Plaintiff

I am interested in the possibility of gathering victims of TimeshareMLS.org for a class action. Please let me know of any information or any interest.

eddies23 wrote:

Does anyone know what the outcome or judgement was in the follwing: Brown v. CHL Marketing, Inc. et al Plaintiff: Erin Brown Defendant: CHL Marketing, Inc. and Howard Levene Case Number: 6:2007cv00854 Filed: May 21, 2007 Court: Florida Middle District Court Office: Orlando Office [Court Info ] County: Orange Presiding Judge: Judge Gregory A. Presnell Referring Judge: Magistrate Judge David A. Baker Nature of Suit: Labor - Fair Labor Standards Act Cause: 29:201 Fair Labor Standards Act Jurisdiction: Federal Question Jury Demanded By: Plaintiff

I am interested in the possibility of gathering victims of TimeshareMLS.org for a class action. Please let me know of any information or any interest.

No offense intended, but let me ask the obvious question --- if you have this much info on the case, why not just directly ask the COURT about the case outcome? If completed, it's now a matter of public record. You could probably even purchase a transcript of all the testimony offered (if it went to trial and if the case is adjudicated).

Why on earth ask about this here, in a timeshare forum?

ken1193 wrote:

eddies23 wrote:

Does anyone know what the outcome or judgement was in the follwing: Brown v. CHL Marketing, Inc. et al Plaintiff: Erin Brown Defendant: CHL Marketing, Inc. and Howard Levene Case Number: 6:2007cv00854 Filed: May 21, 2007 Court: Florida Middle District Court Office: Orlando Office [Court Info ] County: Orange Presiding Judge: Judge Gregory A. Presnell Referring Judge: Magistrate Judge David A. Baker Nature of Suit: Labor - Fair Labor Standards Act Cause: 29:201 Fair Labor Standards Act Jurisdiction: Federal Question Jury Demanded By: Plaintiff

I am interested in the possibility of gathering victims of TimeshareMLS.org for a class action. Please let me know of any information or any interest.

=================================

No offense intended, but let me ask the obvious question --- if you have this much info on the case, why not just directly ask the COURT about the case outcome? If completed, it's now a matter of public record. You could probably even purchase a transcript of all the testimony offered (if it went to trial and if the case is adjudicated).

Why on earth ask about this here, in a timeshare forum?

Why not share it with the public. What better place to do it than a forum? This case was dismissed voluntarily on 9-05-07.

timesharejudi has stated: >> Why not share it with the public. What better place to do it than a forum? This case was dismissed voluntarily on 9-05-07.<< ==================================

Judy: My only point was to ask why any member of the public (you included, by the way, with no disrespect intended) would know (or be able to verify) the outcome of a particular, specific court case, unless they happened to be personally involved? In my own experience, I tend to only believe what a COURT says about court matters. Why would anyone accept an Internet reply as "gospel" when it comes to the outcome of a specific, particular court case (or any other legal matters?). Please don't take personal offense, but how/why/on what factual basis do you happen or claim to have an answer to this inquiry? You've stated an outcome, but haven't "backed it up"...

Ken,

You are 100% right. How many emails do we get that are "gospel" that sound like gospel but are not true and we pass them on and we are passing on a false statement. I should have backed up my statement. Where I got the information requires a login and password so I have cut and pasted this information. If anyone has any questions I would be happy to give them the direction to look it up. I just wish these Companies would go away and stop lying for the almighty dollar. 6:07-cv-00854-GAP-DAB Brown v. CHL Marketing, Inc. et al Gregory A. Presnell, presiding David A. Baker, referral Date filed: 05/21/2007 Date terminated: 09/05/2007 Date of last filing: 09/05/2007

Case Summary Office: Orlando Filed: 05/21/2007 Jury Demand: Plaintiff Demand: Nature of Suit: 710 Cause: 29:201 Fair Labor Standards Act Jurisdiction: Federal Question Disposition: Dismissed - Voluntarily County: Orange Terminated: 09/05/2007 Origin: 1 Reopened:

Lead Case: None Related Case: None Other Court Case: None Def Custody Status: Flag: CLOSED

Plaintiff: Erin Brown represented by K. E. Pantas Phone: 407/425-5775 Fax: 407/425-2778 Email: CLERK@PANTASLAW.COM Defendant: CHL Marketing, Inc. Defendant: Howard Levene https://ecf.flmd.uscourts.gov/cgi-bin/qrySummary.pl?201033

Thanks, Judy.

I'm puzzled by the fact that this case was, according to the info presented, a FLSA related action. That suggests that it was an "employer / employee" issue of some kind (i.e., likely entirely unrelated to the actual parasitic business practices of these particular "marketing" thieves). The fact that the case was "voluntarily dismissed" doesn't say much at all, except that it was either settled out of court with no apparent judicial action or involvement at all, or rejected at the state level for lack of state jurisdiction (FLSA is federal law, not state).

In any event, I certainly share the desire to see every last one of these parasitic, useless, upfront fee "marketing" parasite companies driven right out of business forever. It will likely take legislative change to do that (Federal regulation would be best, in my opinion), or at least the nationwide adoption of state licensing requirements (such as apply to realtors, as you know). These maggots have no conscience whatsoever and serve no purpose other than to take hard earned money from unhappy timeshare owners, offering nothing of any value whatsoever in return. I hope "their day will come" --- when they'll have to go WORK for a living instead of just stealing other people's funds for a living....

ken1193 wrote:

Thanks, Judy.

I'm puzzled by the fact that this case was, according to the info presented, a FLSA related action. That suggests that it was an "employer / employee" issue of some kind (i.e., likely entirely unrelated to the actual parasitic business practices of these particular "marketing" thieves). The fact that the case was "voluntarily dismissed" doesn't say much at all, except that it was either settled out of court with no apparent judicial action or involvement at all, or rejected at the state level for lack of state jurisdiction (FLSA is federal law, not state).

In any event, I certainly share the desire to see every last one of these parasitic, useless, upfront fee "marketing" parasite companies driven right out of business forever. It will likely take legislative change to do that (Federal regulation would be best, in my opinion), or at least the nationwide adoption of state licensing requirements (such as apply to realtors, as you know). These maggots have no conscience whatsoever and serve no purpose other than to take hard earned money from unhappy timeshare owners, offering nothing of any value whatsoever in return. I hope "their day will come" --- when they'll have to go WORK for a living instead of just stealing other people's funds for a living....

I will tell you that as a group we are working on it. The Timeshare Xchange MLS does not work with Brokers that charge an upfront fee and they are trying to work with Legislators that will stop the upfront fees, Companies that charge a fee to take your timeshare off your hands, Closing Companies or Title Companies that provide the outlet for these Companies. The Public needs to voice their opinion as well. So I do appreciate when these problems are brought to light even on a forum. Sometimes it seems that the public is not aware of these problems until they are asked for their credit card. We will have to keep on making a difference. Yesterday is History, Tomorrow is a Mystery and Today is a gift and we can make a difference.

Just wanted to give an update on Timesharemls.org and their activities. They apparently are still going strong with their upfront fee scam. Over the past year they have added at least 3,300 listings to the timesharemls.org website.

At an average upfront scam fee of $600 X 3,300 equals $1,980,000 in scam fees earned by the company. This may quite possibly be a lowball figure on this websites earnings projection.

This also doesn't figure in the sales from the other websites owned by the parent company CHL Marketing. Also, remember, if a timeshareowner is sold a listing package by www.timesharemls.org then they will be contacted at some point during the year by sales reps from their other websites such as www.timesharefsbo.com. Any yes, people do purchase listing packages from their other companies owned by CHL Marketing. The timeshare owner is never informed of the connection.

I urge everyone that has been scammed by the companies I have mentioned and also every other upfront fee scam company to post their experiences on redweek or any other message board, forum, etc. so that a simple web search will bring up multitudes of information on just how sleazy these companies are.

they got me for 400 dollars also guys they said they had a big event coming up where they would be showing properties to a bunch of potential buyers and that they needed some properties in pigeon forge so like a dummy i bit then when i went to their web site they had 45 properties now that 90 day sale has been 250 days and not even a call